As I post this, I know many people will think that I (and similar bloggers) are going to gloat with a ‘I told you so’ attitude. For me, this is not the case. I too am a sinner just like Todd and my righteousness is as filthy rags. My only reason for posting these is that hopefully, christians will become more discerning when these ‘christian superstars’ appear. I CANNOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE,  KNOW HOW TO READ THE BIBLE AND RIGHTLY DIVIDE GOD’S WORD. The bible makes it very clear that the last days will be characterized by deception and false teachers and doctrine. The difference we see here now the consequences of disobeying this commandment and the guidelines about those who are in leadership

Likewise deacons must be reverent, not double-tongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for money, 9 holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience. 10 But let these also first be tested; then let them serve as deacons, being found blameless. 11 Likewise, their wives must be reverent, not slanderers, temperate, faithful in all things. 12 Let deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well. 13 For those who have served well as deacons obtain for themselves a good standing and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus. (1 Tim 3:8-13)

The reason for those admonition is made is now clear to see. If I commited Todd’s sins, I would not have as much effect on those around me because I am just a lay member and am not in a position of leadership (which doesnt make it less sinful by the way) but look at the damage that this episode has now done to the name of Christ. Millions watched it every night which included unbelievers and now it has made the church a laughing stock in the site of those who already believe that christians are just hypocrites. As he says below ‘thousands of hurting people are left questioning God and their salvation’.

Pastor Chris Elrod now recognises that once he started seeing some ‘off things’ from Todd he should have ‘exposed them’ as per Ephesians 5:11.

As I was on my way home from South Carlina last Thursday night I got “the call”. My friend and fellow Lakeland pastor let me know that the news about Todd Bentley…the news that had circulated around Lakeland for weeks…was finally about to break. For months it had been rumors…with very little hard facts to back it up. Local church leaders had been hearing things about Todd…and Ignited Church…that caused us to question even more the validity of the “revival”. Then the truth began to come out bit by bit…first to Lakeland…then the world…and now Todd’s wife was in Canada getting help while he was “floating around” the United States trying to get his head together. Yes Todd had been convicted of molesting a 7-year-old boy in Canada. Yes Todd was legally separating from his wife. Yes there was another woman involved. Yes this was not the first time Todd had been involved with another woman. Yes Todd and Ignited Church had failed to address concerns…many being voice by their own denomination and people that support such Charismatic outpourings…about the heresy being preached and displayed at the “revival”. Yes there was not one single medical document to prove that any healing had actually taken place. Yes the media could find no one…not one single person…to come forward and say they had been healed during the “revival”.

As the fall out continues and more facts are beginning to emerge about everyone involved with this mess, I have begun to ask myself some pretty hard questions. Did I handle this correctly?

When the first news began to break around here about Todd, healings and the revival…I went to see it for myself. In all I attended four separate “revival” meetings over a two month period. I also watched countless hours of the events on the Internet. I witnessed Todd hollering “BAM” a lot. I witnessed “verification teams” in the parking lot carefully choosing people deemed candidates for “healing” while turning many others down. I watched ushers push ill children away from the stage area because they had not been preapproved for “healing”. I heard stories about pixie-dust-spreading angels and conversations with the Apostles in some abstract heavenly cabin. I saw leg drops, high kicks, head punches and every other Wrestlemania cliche under the sun. I heard anonymous crazy stories about people being healed and others being raised from the dead. I heard and saw many strange things…but nothing that even remotely kept with sound doctrine. Every Biblical discerning bone in my body showed me that there was nothing going on at the “revival” that was in keeping with God’s Word.

I began to speak out against the revival, Todd and Ignited Church to our people. Mainly it was through our Journey Groups, one-on-one conversations, phone calls and emails. However, I was advised by several other pastors not to speak out against it publicly because “I might be speaking against something that God is actually doing” (I wasn’t questioning God…I was questioning Todd). Therefore I never addressed it from the pulpit because our podcast is heard by hundreds of people all over the world. I never blogged about it because I get a 1,000+ hits on a normal day. I dodged the questions about the revival in recent radio interviews I did in other parts of the United States. Finally, I refused to answer the hundreds of emails I got about the “revival” from other folks all over the world. In essence I protected my flock from the three-ring circus and hoopla…but did nothing to protect the Body as a whole.

Hindsight they say is 20/20. It now turns out that all of the rumors were true. It now turns out that the Scriptural discernment was correct. It now turns out that this was the same hyper-Charismatic craziness without accountability that the leadership of the sponsoring church is known for. The three ring circus has been packed up, the tents have been taken down, the moral failure has been announcement, everyone involved is pushing back and thousands of hurting people are left questioning God and their salvation. The question that I now have to ask myself…the question that will haunt me for quite a while is…did I sit on the sidelines while the playing field burned? Should have I blogged about it…spoken out about it publicly…done more to get the word out to the rest of the world that this whole thing was about Todd and not God? I took care of my own house…but should I have done more to take care of the entire neighborhood?

I am glad that this Pastor has been brave enough to say this. Lets hope that many other leaders will follow his steps and lead their followers to test ALL things and not just follow every wind of doctrine

Remember to pray for Todd and his family

HT: Independent Conservative

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Comments
  1. Rachel says:

    Great post. We are so afraid of looking judgmental that we put discernment on the back burner. When Todd started making my headlines, a friend was like isn’t this great! Whether or not he is of God, God name is out there, He is moving! As I gave a questioning look in regards to the whole thing , she basically told me not to be a kill-joy. I didn’t say anything – but I felt in my spirit he wasn’t right. Later the spirit convicted me on my silence stance.

    We have to learn to hear the spirit, trust Him, and speak up – if we remain silent people think we agree and people end up being hurt.

    Rachel

  2. BillC says:

    After considering all the evidence, I think that that Todd Bentley is living like a Warlock, taking instructions direct from angels of light (Lucifer, demons etc.).

    2 Cor 11:13-15 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.

    Todd has carried out all his “BAM power” ministry in the name of Jesus, but make that a false Christ:

    Matthew 24:24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect–if that were possible.

    The devil puts on a good show to entice, and Todd has represented the devils way well by satisfying the desires of the flesh for physical sensations, visions, etc.

    2 Thes 2:9-12 The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

    I believe the “bride of Christ” is being enticed to fornicate with demons.

    Take heed Christians, and repent quickly if you have been involved with “charismatic fornication” with other spirits, as it is unclean before God.

    Consider the warning given to believers to stop committing adultery with the “whore of Babylon” in Revelation 18:2-4

    Jesus said “a wicked and adulterous generation asks for a miraculous sign” (Matt 12:39).

    Does “asking for a miraculous sign” demand a performance from God just like the pursuit of supernatural experiences such as being “slain in the spirit”, “Toronto Blessing”, heavenly visitations and visions, etc.?

    The Bible does not endorse people directing the Holy Spirit or teach methods to repeatedly make supernatural experiences or events occur.

    The desire to have experiences could be a self indulgent avoidance of what God really wants us to do.

    When this disobedience and lack of discernment are combined, people may easily accept counterfeit phenomena from the Devil, eg.:

    Matthew 24:24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect–if that were possible.

    Could Christian fellowships become dens of the occult with things like body vibrations, howlings, apparitions, and visions given by demons?

    The seeking of experiences could be an attempt to treat the Holy Spirit like a circus clown or temple prostitute for personal indulgence.
    All these wrong things may be tolerated because there is no fear of God and poor discernment:

    Prov 1:29-31 Since they hated knowledge and did not choose to fear the LORD, since they would not accept my advice and spurned my rebuke, they will eat the fruit of their ways and be filled with the fruit of their schemes.

    At a New Zealand Promise Keepers event 2 years ago well known evangelist Bill Subrizky got all the men up who couldn’t speak in tongues.
    Then he got them to practice saying aba-daba-aba-daba-aba-daba-aba-daba-aba-daba.

    That mocks the Holy Spirit.

    A strong desire for truth, and confidence to reject the false is critical to avoid fraudsters, scams and counterfeits of any type.

    The “big party” will occur in heaven after we die (eg. Rev 19:9), not now.
    For now, we have to prove ourselves faithful through difficulties.
    1 Tim 4:16 Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers.

    If we are truly “hungry for God” we should only do things the Bible specifically affirms, such as repent of sins, develop the fruit of the Spirit (love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control – Gal 5:22-23), worship and appreciate God, endure through trials, help people, read the Bible, share the true gospel, etc.

    Signs, wonders, visions, and other supernatural experiences are God’s business according to his agenda.

    Seeking them is unsafe.

    Todd Bentley and all his mentors should repent of their witchcraft, false teachings and false prophecy.

    Authentic Christians who love the truth avoid unity with falsehood, or even a mixture of true and false.

    Matthew 5:48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

  3. Jan Markell says:

    May I reproduce this citing credit? It is very well written and I have tried to alert people who would not listen. Now the truth comes out.

    Jan Markell
    http://www.olivetreeviews.org

  4. Alan Higgins says:

    John do you want to reproduce the last comment or the original post?

  5. Well it’s Finally came out!!

    More TRUTH about Todd Bentley that he is a FALSE YES FALSE Word of Faith”Healer” that Scams you and not having Doctors Present too see if He/She is Actually HEALED!!

    The Offerings goes too his NEWER Motorcycle,Houses,New clothes too wear when Riding his NEW Motorbike!! and so on from the $$ you given!!(Worst thing of all no TAX Receipts)”WE never GOT OURS ever since we had him in Stony Plain!!”

    We saw Todd Bentley at Sonrise Camp in 2007 and his Team in 2008 and boy it was LONG like till Midnight and it started at 7P.M!!
    Even when we saw Todd Bentley at lighthouse PENTECOSTAL in Stony Plain Alberta was a JOKE YES JOKE too due too People sent BACK too their SEATS because they went up for Prayer but Todd said only Come up when I call your illness(But Honestly we saw the SAME PEOPLE going up Every Night).

    Why have the SAME PEOPLE go up for Prayer when they are Already HEALED the Night Before and even the so called Pastor Archie”Archibald” Binnie was Talking like a $$$ Scam himself and said give this much too God and you will get 100 a Hundred Fold back(Were Still waiting on this since he TALKS about $$$ since 2004).

    It’s like in our Church he calls it Lighthouse Church and not say our REAL NAME Lighthouse PENTECOSTAL Church!! Archie is ASHAMED too be PENTECOSTAL in Word/Mouth!! Lots of Ex STAFF,MEMBERS and even NON told us this Truth since 2000!!

    Wonder why 89% of our Former Church is going too Churches that PREACH YES PREACH the Bible like Alliance,Baptist,Lutheran or even smaller PENTECOSTAL Churches that SPEAK and PREACH the BIBLE!!

    We wish these so called FAITH HEALERS that can READ YES READ their BIBLES YES BIBLES again and not Pick the Words they want too say!!

    Wonder Why Todd Bentley is having a BAD TASTE in our Mouth and many of our Churches he Destroyed YES Destroyed in the Edmonton Area and even our Church of Lighthouse PENTECOSTAL in Stony Plain Alberta!!

    Wonder WHY 80% of our Former PENTECOSTAL Pastors are BURNT OUT or attending a Church(Alliance,Baptist etc) and they have more JOY,PEACE and most of all feeling like Children of GOD and not Working 16 Hour Days and YES not being BURNT OUT or even WORSE having Marriage Affairs that we seen in our PENTECOSTAL Churches that has been done since 1980′s!!!

    So we are OVERJOYED too hear that this so called Faith Healer finally got MORE EXPOSED we were PRAYING for long time ago but the TRUTH finally is known in 2008!!”About Todd Bentley and YES more of these Leaders should get EXPOSED too like Mel Mullen,Dennis Varty,Bob Gal,Cal,Jan Switzer,Alex Florence,Archie Binnie,George,Hazel Hill,Phil Marshall,Laurence Hueppelsheuser”

    WE seen LOTS of our FRIENDS Quit Church due too these Pastors that tells us things that are NOT even in BIBLE and we Cry for them and say you’re always Welcome back too Jesus/God and too have his Awesome Grace,and too live in his Grace and not these faith Healers that Scam you for Money for their New Cars,Houses,House Boats,Clothes and you get the Picture!!(Where your $$ is being Used for).

    A Pastor that saw the REAL LIGHT of God and serving now the God Of GRACE and not these Faith God’s”Faith Healers”.

    • lilB says:

      Oooo!! I have an idea!! How about we stop listing out other pastors names and calling them thieves?! I mean who are we to judge? Doesn’t the Bible tell us that there is only one lawgiver and judge? And obviously that one lawgiver and judge ISN’T any of us. The Bible clearly says that when you judge your brother, you are judging the law and when you judge the law, your not keeping it, but you’re sitting in judgement on it. So seriously, focus on your own personal walk with Jesus and stop pointing fingers at other people and calling some REALLY great pastors THIEVES and saying they spend peoples money on their own stuff because i know for a FACT that they don’t… If you don’t PERSONALLY know them and you’ve just heard ‘rumors’ about them.. STOP JUDGING THEM and spreading false rumors further cuz your just digging a deeper whole for yourself! What good does LYING do for you? Lying doesn’t do any good for anyone.. so please.. do yourself a favor and stop. Sound good? … i think it does.

      • Rock Switzer says:

        Well Maybe If These so Called Pastors Stop Giving People FALSE HOPES And Making Promises Of Being WEALTHY Like 95% Of The Word Of STRIFE Churches and Most Of All PREACH YES PREACH God’s/Jesus WORDS From The BIBLE YES BIBLE And Not Their OWN WORDS What we seen Since 1997 !!!

        Maybe THE TRUTH NEEDS TOO BE KNOWN Of THESE NUTTY Pastors So YES THEY NEED TOO BE EXPOSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • denis varety says:

      Denis varaty is a false prophet he was exposes by a leader named Fergus Macintyre at strathcona community church a while back and was part of the Whole Tom cook Scandal. The word that exposed Denis for who he is is “STOP OR GODS GONNA STOP” After this he shortly left the church and God brought healing and restoration to our church at Strathcona community. I t doesnt suprise me now after all this stuff has come out about Todd Bently.

      • denis varety says:

        i think you were referring to a person by the name of Dennis laravie not Varaty if I am not mistaken we should not judge

      • Gail Fisher says:

        Hi Denis I am not sure if I know you we attended Strathcona church right up until it moved into the new building in 2001? My husband and I attended a special invititaion only marriage retreat hosted by Rick & Nel of course and led by Tom Cook. During this retreat Mr. Cook took me aside and in front of my husband started saying some very pornographic and horific things to me regarding how I should be dressing etc for my husband (that I should be like a prostitute for him etc) all the while he sat there on the stage facing me and kicking me in the shins with his cowboy boots on! I found all that he said so far beyond degrading I left the church sobbing and did for days afterwards. I was asked by Rick to attend the worship service at the church later that week. I was subsequently cornered by Tom, his wife & Nel and accused of being among other things a Jezabel in the Church. I went home and locked myself in I was afraid for weeks that Mr Cook was going to come and lay into me again…I left the Church and never went back…Imagine my surprise at reading the words “Tom Cook Scandal” care to elaborate?? It would do a lot to quell all the questions I have had since.
        My husband (Ray Lobbes)and I were friends of Randy & Karen Harasym & Family also the Korzans, MacIntyres, Sommervills, Billingtons..and I guess most everybody back then…they were a lovely group of people and thanks to Facebook we are slowly starting to find eachother again :-) Thanks Denis

        • Meg says:

          Hi Gail, I know this is an old post and I realize you may not see this but I thought I would try anyways, can you please elaborate on this Tom Cook and the scandal you are referring to? My dad is heavily involved in the charasmatic movement and has just finished telling me about a Tom Cook who he has met who is “extremely prophetic” and he’s talking about this tom cooke as if he is Jesus himself! my dad did mention this Tom has a past and was in jail but was elusive when I asked what he went to jail for saying it might “disqualify him” in my eyes. I cannot find anything on the net about him, except this post came up in the google results. would much appreciate it if you (or anyone who sees this post and knows anything) could tell me anything at all, youf can email me at meg.pieroway@live.ca if you like, thank you and God bless!

          • Yes. I have also tried to research Tom Cook and came across this posting. In my circles, it is alleged that he served jail time for sexual assault, connect to his ministry work. Some churches in Edmonton and Calgary may have more details on this. He was a very powerful and intimidating person and, for some, he had a notable and freakishly bang-on prophetic ministry. Strange how he`s off the radar…..

            I was coerced to his Legacy Conference in Red Deer, AB back in 2002 by one of his minions. Yes, Tom was given ‘Jesus’ status among his followers. I saw it! I thought, “this feels like a cult.” There were about 100-150 people there. Everything was paid for, how I don`t know.At that time, Tom said he was leaving the West and heading back to the East. I thought, “it’s like Jesus is leaving the disciples all over again.” The attendees were there for Tom, they worshipped him. For me, the whole setting was creepy!

            The pastor who manipulated me into come to this conference also abused members of his church and staff through multiple sick and abhorrent modes. To me, it is questionable whether Tom and some of his minions didn`t potentially have a thing going, seeking out vulnerable victims to pray/prey upon. Back in the day, this pastor invited Tom to our church a couple of times. I met with him. I can attest to him personally hitting on women and making sexualized and other inappropriate remarks to vulnerable congregants. Cook was a magical tornado swirling through churches and impressing some , but leaving a broken path of destruction behind.

      • Jean says:

        I know this thread is very old, but i am wondering if you can give me more information about this Tom Cook. There is ow a Tom Cook “prophet” in my city (Barrie, Ontario, Canada) who is pretty much running a cult. He drinks during his service with a congregation if recovering alcoholics & is said to promote rather lustful behaviour. My friends have been sucked in by him, but i can’t find anything on the internet about him. (i don’t want to have to go to one of his ‘meetings’). Could this be the same Tom Cook? If so, please help me learn more background info about him & what the ‘scandal’ was.
        Thank you!

        • Meg says:

          This DEFINATELY the same Tom Cook! email me at meg.pieroway@live.ca and we can chat, I was looking for information on him too and have had TONS of people respond…my dad is highly involved with him and is “ministry” in Barrie….

          • Tom Cook says:

            Regarding Tom Cook:
            The fruit speaks for itself. It’s been 8 years since Alberta began to really take stock of the devastation left in the wake of his ministry. It is hard to believe the far reaching effect that it had. The pain and the grief and the number of really strong and faithful people of God who are still trying to recover after all of this time is a cautionary tale. We want superstars, we wanted strong men who moved in power, we wanted a hero to follow. We wanted it so badly that – like the frog in the pot of boiling water – we moved from being enamoured with him to laying down our responsibility for the protection of our flocks. In the aftermath we shake our heads at our own sin in giving up our authority to protect the sheep and we repent and we all continue to rebuild knowing that there are thousands still struggling to be in community or to trust leadership again. On the upside, we now know what it looks like and how sweet it tastes until it turns to ash in the mouth.

    • Hamman says:

      Greetings “Ex-Pastor”, I saw a similar post of yours on another blog and I am curious to know why you mention Dennis Varty? I am prayerfully approaching this subject and am only interested in knowing the truth. Could you please explain in more detail, thank you

    • Roshinie says:

      I am not sure if u will see this . Just need clarity on status of Todd Bently coz he is presently in South Africa doing a crusade . Please advise if he has fully repented n back in ministry
      Many thanks n blessings

  6. konakofe says:

    when true shepherds return to leadership, so will the sheep. until then, the sheep will continue to wander looking for a true shepherd. problem, the longer they wander, the loster they get. with all the lost sheep wandering around, i see only one conclusion. a lot of wolves out there teaching a lot of false doctrine. because leadership has built their house on sand it has forfeited it’s right to point fingers, complain or lecture anyone about anything. on the other side, the sheep have earned corrupt leadership because we have never held their feet or our own to the biblical fire. there is no biblical mandate requiring us to tolerate any snakes in our midst. all we gotta do is read, comprehend and apply equally ALL the bible teaches on this subject. but with so few biblically rooted shepherds, what we gonna do?

  7. Ruthie R says:

    I have been a christian all my life…! Grown up in my faith then back slidden etc. depends on whose opinion. I am very confused as to what is real and what is not any more. The black and white nothing in between closed minded christianity of my parents is too judgemental and turns everyone off, but the ratical charasmatic ones seem to turn out to be fakes so how does one discern truth from lies. I am going through some hard times and need prayer. I have asked for prayer by some ministries are thought where legit now I am totally confused is God really there. I finally had faith again, that things will work out now everyone is bad or messed up what do I believe.

    confused in Canada

    • Leslie Collins says:

      My advise to you is if you are confused is to logon to http://www.jsm.org (Jimmy Swaggart Ministries) and listen to Son-life Radio. At 10:00est they have a program called Frances and Friends that cover false doctrine that’s in the church. Jimmy Swaggart’s Ministryand sonlife radio has blessed my life so much because their focus is Christ and Him crucified. Also, I advise the Expositor’s Study Bible It will explain the Word of God to you. Also, I advise praying specifically about your situation, letting the Lord know that you desire His truth and He will lead you and remove all confusion.

    • Lorne says:

      Hello …confused in Canada;

      God loves you and cares about your life. Read the Bible yourself; find out what God says in His Word.

      We will see all kinds of men, women, and children, doing all kinds of things and even stupid things, until Jesus returns, but we must remember that God is still on the throne; He loves you; give your life to Jesus; tell him out loud that you are sorry about your sins. Ask Him to forgive you (and He will….)

      Forget about people who are speaking judgement on other people, christians, so called christians or whoever. Ask God to forgive them too; they are perhaps sinners saved by grace, or just sinners…that need a savior. Pray for them.

      “God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that whosoever would believe in Him (Jesus) would not perish but have everlasting life, for Jesus did not come to the world to judge people, but because He loved mankind each and all every person.” John 3:16.

      Read the Book of John several times; it speaks about the life of Jesus. Read it out loud…every day for a month.

      By the way, I am not a hero or anyone important; I am just a sinner saved by grace. (Saved from what? Eternal death and hell!!!) I have been saved for 30 years and I am finding life is awesome. I am free. Jesus loves me. Praise the Lord.

      Yes and Jesus heals; yes He does. The Bible says so in
      1Peter 2:24 and Isaiah 53:5 & 6. You can take that to the bank!

  8. Kyle says:

    Hey Ruthie!

    I can tell you from my own walk with the Lord that I too fell away when I was in college. However, let me tell you something profound. If you were really saved then you never were able to really fall away. Like I during my rebellion season I always felt the Holy Spirit pulling at me. I felt conviction. I tried to avoid other Christians I knew because of shame. Ruthie if that were you then you never lost your salvation. Christ would walk the ends of the earth to bring you back seeing that he would NEVER lose one of his sheep. God elected you Ruthie. You were blood bought and saved by the grace of God and Grace alone. Nothing can take that away.

    If you have specific questions and you want to ask them please do. Never assume that your situation is/was different then most other Christians.

    I hope to hear from you soon!

    In Christ,

    Kyle

  9. Laura says:

    Ruthie

    I agree with all that Kyle says. My testimony also follows the same route. Do not be afraid but rejoice that the Lord has drawn you back to His flock and you are once again seeking Him.

    My personal experience has dragged me all over the show, but one thing I will say. There is nothing grey about God’s law. The Bible is black and white. Maybe you are feeling your parents are judgemental because they are challenging your lifestyle, or those of your friends? I know I felt that way also once, but now I’d rather be totally convicted of any sin before it took a hold on my life.

    ‘Come as you are, stay as you are’ Christianity is false, God is loving and forgiving to those who seek forgiveness. But those not living in His light and without repentance and true change from the heart outwards will fall short.

  10. Mark Bowers says:

    Hi,

    I just happened on this blog site today and am wondering what all this is about re Todd and the other pastors that are mentioned (specifically Cal and Jan Switzer). I agree that these people were / are money hungry scammers that stripped a lot of folks of their hard earned money and in some case most of their savings ( including me). But this thing with Todd seems quite a bit more serious.

    I attended VCC in Edmonton from 1995 to 97 until I started working overseas. My wife attended up until 2000 but these guys took a lot of personal and financial possesions from my wife. A long story but I was never too comfortable with Cal and Jan (and there flash cars and clothes etc)

    Mark Bowers, (Kuwait)

  11. Ruth says:

    The thing that really gets to me, is the total waste of time this whole issue is. It has sucked up people’s time like you would not believe. Just as Alan here states, he visited the meetings 4 times, and then watched countless hours on the net or TV.

    I think the enemy really had a hold on people (and still is) who should be focussing on going about the Father’s business – whatever it is that God is calling you to do.

    Even now, we need to be careful, not to spend too much time digging up all the details, discussing things.
    Lets get on with bringing people to Christ, touching hurting lives with God’s power and love…. LETS MOVE ON! and be wiser next time.

    I firmly believe this whole thing highlights a couple of basic issues – It is not about Todd Bentley – Todd has just brought a big problem to the forefront.

    God will not share his glory with another. He is a jealous God. We put people on a pedestal that God has not placed them on. Lots of people are on pedestals. We give ourselves titles… we expect reverence and respect.

    We must focus our eyes firmly on Jesus, and discern what role we as people (including leaders)play – a role of humility and service.

  12. konakofe says:

    to #7 ruthie r
    you are doing the right thing by reaching out. it hurts to be in a dark and evil world but know and remember this, He that is in you is greater than your accuser. you have G-D’s permission to cry and pour out your pain to Him. seek His face and you will see only loving-kindness. press into Him, know the strength and protection of His arms and then listen to the heart of the Lion of Judah. looking back we only see shadows. looking to Him and we see only Light. be of good cheer and protect your brave heart.

    suggestion: contact “grace to you” at 1-800-554-7223 or letters@gty.org. they may have a group in your area where you can find a safe harbour in your storm.

  13. randy says:

    Ruth, and others.

    Billy Graham Ministries offers solid Word and solid understanding. The NKJ Bible with their studies and
    help sections, would assit any hungry Believer.
    May i suggest checking it out.
    Contact them online. They have a 1-800 number there too.
    Also, you can ask for a recommended church to go to,
    in your area. A Pastor there can answer your questions
    effectively as you attend regularly.

    Hope that helps.

    Here is a cute ditty i heard.

    “Too much Word, you dry up,
    too much Spirit, you blow up,
    Get both, you grow up.”

    (-:

  14. BillC says:

    The Todd Bentley “situation” is possibly less about Todd, and more about discernment, which appears to have been completely lacking from many church leaders.

    Consider the prophecies spoken over Todd Bentley at his commissioning ceremony.

    Here are the transcripts:
    Peter Wagner:
    “This commissioning represents a powerful spiritual transaction taking place in the invisible world. With this in mind, I take the apostolic authority that God has given me and I decree to Todd Bentley:
    Your power will increase.
    Your authority will increase.
    Your favor will increase.
    Your influence will increase.
    Your revelation will increase.
    I also decree that:
    A new supernatural strength will flow through this ministry.
    A new life force will penetrate this move of God.
    Government will be established to set things in their proper order.
    God will pour out a higher level of discernment to distinguish truth from error.
    New relationships will surface to open the gates to the future.”

    Che Ahn:
    “Recognizing that God has chosen you and appointed you to bear much and lasting fruit in this Lakeland revival, and revival around the world.
    Recognizing that He has called you as an Ephesians 4 evangelist and a revivalist moving in signs and wonders.
    Knowing that you have walked in a manner worthy of the Lord, pleasing Jesus in every way, bearing fruit in every good work, and growing in the intimacy and knowledge of God, we as your brothers and your friends, who have a deep love for you, Shonnah, your whole family, we just esteem you.
    We are here to stand with you, support you.
    And we are here to commission you in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit–in the power of His name–with special oil from Chuck Pierce.
    It’s called ‘Revival Oil.’ Chuck could not make it, so he sent this Fed-Ex. Special oil for you. He’s in Africa.
    And so we anoint you and commission you in Jesus’ name.”

    John Arnott:
    “We bless you today, Todd Bentley. You’re a friend. You’re a man of God. You’re a man of prayer. You’re a man of the spirit. You love the anointing.
    And I would say that it’s not just the Lakeland revival, but the whole world that goes into revival.
    And you’re leading an amazing charge.
    And, multitudes are getting in behind you and saying, ‘Come on. I’m gonna go with you.’
    And so we bless all of that. Thank you, Holy Spirit, for raising up this young man, to lead such a mighty charge around the world, and to partner with God TV in all that has happened here in the last, uh, several months now, three months almost.
    We bless it in the name of Jesus, and we stand with you, and we encourage you, and we honor you.”

    Dr. Clarice Fluitt:
    “Hallelujah! For the word of the Lord would say, Behold the vanguard. Behold the tugboat that is cutting through the ice of religious traditions–the cruel, hard things.
    The understanding of the mind of men will now bow to the reality of the revelation of the finished work of Calvary.
    Behold, sayeth God, you have been equipped with cutting power.
    You have been equipped to go through those traditions of the mind of man.
    Yea, sayeth God, and you are pulling the church into the realm of glory.
    Behind you is a great ship that is laden with healing and deliverance and prosperity. This is the word to you, oh man of God- arise, kill, and eat.
    No longer; no longer; no longer will men call unclean what I have called clean.”

    The first 2 (Peter Wagner and Che Ahn) can be seen on video at http://vodpod.com/watch/835371-todd-bentleys-apostolic-and-prophetic-commissioning-14

    Dutch Sheets is also a false prophet who promotes “New Age” (occult) teachings, see http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/narfalseprophecies.html and http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/wagnerquotes.html

    The Bible warns of false practitioners (savage wolves) who will infiltrate and harm the church:

    Matthew 7:15-17 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.

    Mark 13:5-6 Jesus said to them: “Watch out that no one deceives you. Many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’ and will deceive many.

    Todd Bentley was mostly a false practitioner (going by the fruit of his practices, teaching and personal life) and he was commissioned by people whose fruit is false prophecy.

    I think it is all an exercise in discernment, as the Bible predicts there will be worse to come:
    Matthew 24:10-13 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.

    We should encourage each other, not with manifestations, and “experiences”, but with the word of God, the Bible.

    It is full of wonderful counsel to endure through difficult times:

    Psalm 62:5-9 Find rest, O my soul, in God alone; my hope comes from him. He alone is my rock and my salvation; he is my fortress, I will not be shaken. My salvation and my honor depend on God; he is my mighty rock, my refuge. Trust in him at all times, O people; pour out your hearts to him, for God is our refuge.
    Lowborn men are but a breath, the highborn are but a lie; if weighed on a balance, they are nothing; together they are only a breath.
    Psalm 62:11-12 One thing God has spoken, two things have I heard: that you, O God, are strong, and that you, O Lord, are loving. Surely you will reward each person according to what he has done

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  16. Tim says:

    I, for one, was never afraid of looking judgmental. I have a friend who is a kook. He is a charismatic hack who seeks after signs and wonders. I pray for him daily. He is lead astray by every “new thing God is doing” and Todd Bentley was one of those things.

    My friend told me to go down to the Lakeland Outpouring, that miracles were happening there. So, I decided to do some research of my own. I saw two sermons/healing services of Todd Bentley in action and immediately I wanted to puke. That was 5 months ago.

    I could not believe that thousands of people could be so foolish. I could not believe that so many people lacked even a shred of discernment. Are we that naive? Are we that eager to be fooled? No wonder the world looks upon Christians with scorn and ridicule. We have come by it honestly.

    We should be ashamed of ourselves. I know I am.

    Tim

  17. Victoria says:

    May those that has negative opinion about Todd Bently, have you reason out from your natural flesh or you have worded your opinion from the Holy Spirit?

    I know alot of Americans like to view their opinions openly but I just wonder whether you have seek God of the following

    1) Have you seek God before voicing out your opinion?
    2) Have your opinion being born from your own reasoning (flesh) or from God.

    Pls consider!

  18. Alan Higgins says:

    In summary, everything that I have said has been grounded in the word of God.

  19. Bud Press says:

    Hi Victoria:

    Christians are under a Scriptural command to test all things and try the spirits by what God has already established in His written word(1 Thessalonians 5:21; 1 John 4:1).

    For the Christian who truly loves the Lord, His word is the go-to and final authority. Feelings and emotions are not to be relied upon.

    When anyone claims to be a Christian, but teaches falsely, Christians are under the Scriptural command to defend the faith and expose the unfruitful works of darkness (Jude 3; Ephesians 5:11; Acts 20:27-31).

    I don’t have a “negative opinion” about Todd Bentley–nothing personal. In fact, I love him in Christ. However, I love the Lord and the truth of His written word more. And it is love that prompts me to warn the body of Christ about the wolves in sheep’s clothing.

    I, and many others, pray that God will be merciful to Todd Bentley, send solid, Bible-based Christians to minister to him, open his eyes and ears to the truth, and be born again.

    In Christian love,
    Bud Press

  20. Doug P says:

    Hey been down the VCC path myself, hurt there very unforgiving people. Booted from a funeral of my best friend. Asked to leave and go down the road in tears. Everything is about money. Your their friend if you dont stir the pot and have money. Is not everything in life like that man. I have seen Todd Bently and heard of the lakeland revival. Been to those things even in Toronto. The same spirit asked to leave. They want absolute unquestioned follow that rat pack agree with them or else submission for their decietful mission. People constantly use GOD GOD GOD to scare you. God will get you if you dont. To this day I have been blessed by many experience and am much much wiser fo it, and am definitely not a sucker to the scams. Im not that nieve. Some people just go on submitting to it all. They dont think just want some kind of disneyland holy ghost sounding joy ride without real life bible. We have all been caught in all these types of things. Money men who use God and Christ and fear to make tonnes of money “In the name of Jesus” People go broke due to these guys. Who would go broke for me? They all know what they are doing and do it well, they plan things like a concert. Plan things like a political rally etc. They dont like being accused of different things espcially if they are found to have merit to them. You have to be pure and holy to have a great ministry. God id God and God does not need our help, he hasthe real power to heal with out our “big shows”. But big set up shows are great for bringing in money and desperate people who may be suckers to it all. Thank God for the understanding. Great message hear it sure shows that no one is perfect although they claim to be and wont admit and correct their own faults. I am amazed that people in the hype give to blatantly to these people. Just spread the real word and maybe hand out nothing but bibles instead of creating false sense of spiritual wellness. Nothing is that instant. Glad to have read this blog here, very infomative. People wake up!

  21. Lyndsey says:

    I happened upon this website also…You can not judge the heart of people – only God can. And to the person who mentioned all the pastors who they think are crooks, I would be very careful about what you say. You can judge them by their fruits. As in Todd Bentley’s case…his fruit has been shown, but to go after every church that is effective and active in the community is WRONG. Jesus warned about blaspheming the Holy Spirit -unpardonable sin-(Saying that the work of the Holy Spirit was the work of the devil). Again….I’m not talking about Todd Bently, if you don’t have facts, and are just offended, tread lightly. Church we can’t be pointing fingers!! We have to be united. We may do things differently, but it is still the same Jesus. And about the leaders who are not managing their flocks right, THEY have to account, not to YOU, but to GOD. All this online gossip makes me sick..

  22. Alan Higgins says:

    We should only be united when it comes to the word of God rightly divided. When it is wrongly divided and falsehood is preached and this can be proved by the scriptures, that is where the unity ends. we are admonished to expose the unfruitful works of darkness and to judge with righteous judgement. See http://realchristianity.wordpress.com/2008/05/07/judge-not/

  23. Marsha says:

    I think if we are to use scriptures we should read (at least) the chapter in it’s entirety (and sometimes the chapters before and after) to get a full understanding of what is being said. If someone sins it does not necessarily mean that the works were not of God. We must be balanced.

    Who can say they never sinned or made a wrong decision since they’ve been born again?

    2 Corinthians 13 (AMP) deals with Christians and sin…

    7But I pray to God that you may do nothing wrong, not in order that we [our teaching] may appear to be approved, but that you may continue doing right, [though] we may seem to have failed and be unapproved.

    8For we can do nothing against the Truth [not serve any party or personal interest], but only for the Truth [which is the Gospel].

    9For we are glad when we are weak (unapproved) and you are really strong. And this we also pray for: your all-round strengthening and perfecting of soul.

    We tend to want to condemn people and because they fall short we think they could never have been used by God and yet we think God can use us…

    And Romans 3 (AMP)says

    23Since all have sinned and are falling short of the honor and glory which God bestows and receives.

    24[All] are justified and made upright and in right standing with God, freely and gratuitously by His grace (His unmerited favor and mercy), through the redemption which is [provided] in Christ Jesus,

    25Whom God put forward [before the eyes of all] as a mercy seat and propitiation by His blood [the cleansing and life-giving sacrifice of atonement and reconciliation, to be received] through faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in His divine forbearance He had passed over and ignored former sins without punishment.

    26It was to demonstrate and prove at the present time (in the now season) that He Himself is righteous and that He justifies and accepts as righteous him who has [true] faith in Jesus.

    27Then what becomes of [our] pride and [our] boasting? It is excluded (banished, ruled out entirely). On what principle? [On the principle] of doing good deeds? No, but on the principle of faith.

    Remember Jimmy Swaggart? And yet after all he went through God is using him again (look him up online).

    Ideally we wouldn’t give into sin, and yes we DON’T HAVE to give in, but if we do it doesn’t change the past (if God used you or not) it can only affect the present and the future. You can get up, ask for forgiveness (maybe take sometime to heal and grow and be accountable to someone) and move on to do what God has called you to, or you can stay in the dirt and ashes and think of what could’ve or should’ve been.

    God forgives and so should we. I don’t say we pretend it never happened and allow it to continue, however I do say we don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. 1 Peter 4 (AMP) says
    1SO, SINCE Christ suffered in the flesh for us, for you, arm yourselves with the same thought and purpose [patiently to suffer rather than fail to please God]. For whoever has suffered in the flesh [having the mind of Christ] is done with [intentional] sin [has stopped pleasing himself and the world, and pleases God],

    2So that he can no longer spend the rest of his natural life living by [his] human appetites and desires, but [he lives] for what God wills.

    3For the time that is past already suffices for doing what the Gentiles like to do–living [as you have done] in shameless, insolent wantonness, in lustful desires, drunkenness, reveling, drinking bouts and abominable, lawless idolatries.

    THEN continues on to say

    8Above all things have intense and unfailing love for one another, for love covers a multitude of sins [forgives and disregards the offenses of others].

    Which says that even though we are not chained to sin and should not sin, in the event that a brethren does sin, we are to forgive.

    The Word of God also says in
    Psalm 105 vs 15 “Touch not my anointed ones,do my prophets no harm!” If you don’t know if someone is a false prophet then ask God. Pray and He will answer. Romans 8 vs 14 (NKJV)says For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. Sometimes we use our own personal beliefs, feelings or opinions to determine things that God is not necessarily saying, so we must be careful to not fit God or His Word into our way of thinking or our justification but to accept His Word as true and final and allow Him to show us His Truth which is really the only truth and only answer!

  24. konakofe says:

    to #23: alan higgins
    a very well said response to some of the weak minded comments that preceed.

    to #22: lyndsey
    i agree that only g-d has the right to judge the heart of each of us.

    i have never believed all pastors are serpents and i have never advocated nor will i ever tolerate baseless “witch hunts”.

    there are very strong biblical mandates concerning these issues. bearing false witness (equated with murder) is a grievous sin. tolerating corruption within a congregation brings judgement upon that body.

    it is impossible to blaspheme the Holy Spirit when all biblical mandates are taught in context, in their entirety and walked out in loving balance.

    i always tread very lightly. but when i have the facts about a local “todd bentley”, i will stand and point my finger. these false teachers are not ultimately accountable to me but i will continue to hold them accountable by holding their feet to the biblical fire. i don’t like it but this is regularly applied to me also. truth subverted to unity is heresy.

    gossip is sickening, but so is a position held in opposition to the truth of scripture.

    konakofe

  25. konakofe says:

    to: alan higgins

    your thoughts and/or comments on the following will be appreciated.

    should scripture be studied from an israelite context? if yes, why? if no, why?

    where does romans chapters 9, 10 and 11 fit into the current church?

    what is the scriptural basis for dividing the bible and the body of believers into old versus new testament/covenent?

    what is the scriptural basis for dividing the
    church from the israel of g-d?

    why is the twig of the grafted in gentiles now independent of the olive tree?

    what is the connection between jacob, israel and the israel of g-d? g-d of israel, israel of g-d?

    why does the g-d of abraham, isaac and jacob figure so prominently in apostolic times and not into current greco-roman christianity?

    does any of the above figure into the current lack of discernment, the ability to rightly divide the word of g-d, the on-going flood of aberrant teachers and our pre-occupation with these serpents antics?

    thanks

  26. Alan Higgins says:

    Konakofe,my rule is not veer off the topic in my post so when I get a chance I will send you an email with my thoughts

  27. billcnz says:

    The fruit of Todd Bentley’s ministry is adultery, lying, loving money, false teaching, and false prophecy.

    This has made a laughing stock of God, Jesus Christ, The Holy Spirit, The Bible, and all Christians throughout the world, through the widely publicised Todd Bentley ministry via the internet.

    Todd Bentley claimed he had access to “The angel of finance”, and that donating money at his services would cause the giver huge blessing from this angel. Whether he was lying, or actually did see such an angel, both are wrong.

    The only “angel of finance” the Bible mentions is Lucifer, in tempting Jesus Christ about worldly wealth Luke 4:5-7 “The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. So if you worship me, it will all be yours.”

    “if you worship me, it will all be yours”.

    Is Todd Bentley’s “angel of finance” a deception towards worship of Lucifer?

    “Angel of finance” indirectly introduces teaching that goes BEYOND the Bible, eg. that God encourages the seeking of money, and that we should be contacting angels for it.

    The Bible actually DISCOURAGES seeking of money, so an angel that turns up to encourage it must be a satanic counterfeit intent on deception. Scripture exposes the deception:

    1 Tim 6:10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.

    Luke 16:13-14 “No servant can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.”
    The Pharisees, who loved money, heard all this and were sneering at Jesus.

    TODD BENTLEY’S mystical revelations are rejected by scripture as EVIL COUNSEL.

    Sadly, ANY averagely intelligent 10 year old UNBELIEVING CHILD could easily have done the CORRECT DISCERNMENT of Todd Bentley ministry with the most BASIC LOGIC:

    “Dad, those church people look like they’re nuts. They’re vibrating, twitching, having slurred speech, gibberish speech and sound effects, animal acts – dogs, chickens, lions, etc., staggering about, falling over, and having uncontrollable/irrational laughter”.

    “And Mr. Bentley his holding hands with another lady, not Mrs Bentley”.

    “Son, stay away from them, they must be into something devilish”.

    That is the correct discernment.

    When people manifesting like Todd Bentley are accepted in churches, it is proof there is no discernment at all.

    There has been a sinister development with Todd Bentley, which warrants serious consideration regarding the spiritual power people are giving themselves over to.

    Todd Bentley has abandoned his wife, and established an adultery covenant with another – see http://westernstandard.blogs.com/shotgun/2009/03/todd-bentley-marries-woman-whom-he-had-extramarital-affair-with.html

    Rick Joyner is defending Todd Bentley to continue in the new adulterous relationship – http://www.morningstarministries.org/Articles/1000045589/MorningStar_Ministries/Media/Special_Bulletins/2009/Special_Bulletin_17.aspx

    Rick Joyner is known to be a member of “Knights of Malta”, which is an occultic network with links to Roman Catholic church, etc. – google “rick joyner knight of malta”

    The manifestations, teachings and prophecies from the Todd Bentley / Peter Wagner / Rick Joyner / John Crowder / Patricia King networked people, and all who call themselves mystics, seem to line up with Satanic ministry.

    See http://users.skynet.be/fa390968/AlphaSleepnet.pdf which has a network diagram on the second page.

    Sexual immorality is a known initiation rite for satanic covens, because it is a deliberate desecration against the marriage relationship instituted by the God of Genesis 1:1. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleister_Crowley

    Aleister Crowley followed “the god of this age” (2 Cor 4:4) or “prince of this world” (John 16:11), which seems the case for all people in churches who align themselves with mysticism (Todd Bentley, John Crowder, Rick Joyner, Peter Wagner, etc.).

    Todd Bentley’s adultery covenant with Jessa Hasbrook may be an important rite to qualify him for deeper ministry and power from Lucifer.

    This may be the reason why people like Peter Wagner and Rick Joyner support Todd Bentley CONTINUING with the adultery, rather than REPENT of it.

    Ungodly covenants should be renounced.

    I wonder how many mystics and members of those networks are involved in sexual immorality, or are divorced and “remarried”, in order to increase their collective power from Lucifer?

    1 Cor 5:11-13 “But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.
    What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked man from among you.”

    Should Todd Bentley be expelled from all Christian fellowship worldwide until he repents of and discontinues marriage type relationship with anyone except his wife Shonnah Bentley?

    >> Psalm 105 vs 15 “Touch not my anointed ones, do my prophets no harm!” (Marsha 31 Oct 2008)

    It is harmful NOT TO CHALLENGE prophets predicting unscriptural outcomes, such as Todd Bentley’s “angel of finance” teaching. It is also harmful not to challenge them for persisting in adulterous relationships.

  28. Alan Higgins says:

    lilB. Go to http://realchristianity.wordpress.com/2008/08/17/2008/05/07/judge-not/ and that will answer everything that you said

  29. Alan Higgins says:

    Switz09, your comment was taken off because you are constantly spamming this thread and you comments have nothing to do with this thread

  30. billcnz says:

    “Slain”……. churches are falling over!
    ============================

    Todd Bentley was probably ACCEPTED BY MANY Christians because he operated Toronto “Blessing” type spiritual phenomena that achieved widespread acceptance MANY YEARS prior.

    These phenomena are sensational and pleasurable, many people are attracted by them, so many Christians may assume that is good to get more people coming in the church door.

    However it is actually a diabolical INTRUSION to ruin churches.

    Toronto “blessing” type ministry is attractive to many church leaders as a supernatural power they can DISPENSE to people.
    They become spiritual drug dealers, and many people get “hooked”.

    Attempting to command, wave, and prod the Holy Spirit or Jesus INTO PEOPLE is gross misbehaviour against God.

    He will not be commanded by men or be indulged like a prostitute for drunken frolicks.
    The phenomena isn’t a blessing from God.
    It is an INFILTRATION OF OCCULT POWER from the same source as Hindu “Shaktipat”. Google “Shaktipat”.

    Toronto “Blessing” is WIZARDRY and MAGIC ARTS from familiar spirits (demons masquerading as friendly):
    Lev 20:6 And the soul that turneth after such as have FAMILIAR SPIRITS, and after wizards, to go a whoring after them, I will even set my face against that soul, and will cut him off from among his people. (KJV)

    Rev 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice MAGIC ARTS, the idolaters and all liars–their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.

    Toronto “Blessing” definitely didn’t come from the creator God, as he NEVER imparts manifestations similar to mental illness or drunken / drugged, as that is a contradiction of a SOUND MIND and SELF CONTROL which he has REPEATEDLY endorsed in the Bible.

    The only exception might be when God PUNISHES SOMEONE by putting them into a drunken stupor, which would ALSO be a WARNING to others.

    Christians should not PROVOKE punishment from God:
    Isaiah 8:13 The LORD Almighty is the one you are to regard as HOLY, he is the one you are to FEAR, he is the one you are to DREAD

    The Bible repeatedly asserts DRUNKENNESS as IMMORAL.

    The Bible does not endorse a righteous version of drunkenness, just as there is no righteous version of stealing, adultery or lying.

    Rom 13:12-14 The night is far spent, the day is at hand. Therefore let us CAST OFF the works of darkness, and let us put on the armor of light. let us WALK PROPERLY, as in the day, NOT IN REVELRY AND DRUNKENNESS, not in lewdness and lust, not in strife and envy. But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts.

    On the Day of Pentecost Christian disciples preached the gospel in various languages which impressed listeners who comprehended the message in their own language. (Acts 2:1-47)
    However MOCKERS accused the disciples of being drunk for speaking authentic languages the disciples normally didn’t know.
    The FALSE ACCUSATION OF MOCKERS should not be used to justify spiritual or physical drunkenness.

    2 Cor 4:4 The GOD OF THIS AGE has BLINDED THE MINDS OF UNBELIEVERS, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

    Spiritual drunkenness blinds the minds of BELIEVERS!

    The Bible encourages us to TEST THE SPIRITS, and that should include USING YOUR MIND to ANALYSE the outcomes (manifestations) in conjunction with seeking what THE BIBLE says about it.
    This is what a RENEWED MIND is for.
    1 John 4:1 … test the spirits to see whether they are from God…
    Romans 12:2 …be transformed by the RENEWING OF YOUR MIND. Then you will BE ABLE TO TEST and approve what God’s will is–his good, pleasing and perfect will.

    Being discerning includes being CAUTIOUS.
    “The fear of the Lord” includes being cautious.
    God recommends this to protect us from harm.

    Spiritual drunkenness ministries (eg. John Crowder) that encourage reckless abandon towards God are DEFYING Gods repeating counsel in the Bible.

    2 Cor 11:14-15 Satan himself MASQUERADES as an ANGEL OF LIGHT. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.
    Rev 20:10 And the devil, who DECEIVED THEM, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

    Playing around with counterfeit “angels of light” (familiar spirits) might be BLISS and ECSTASY now, but if not repented of will lead to REJECTION by the Most High God FOREVER.

    The “big party” will occur in heaven AFTER WE DIE, not now (Rev 19:9).

    Scripture asserts we now have SERIOUS WORK to do while remaining firmly SOBER.
    2 Tim 4:5 …. KEEP YOUR HEAD in all situations, endure hardship, DO THE WORK of an evangelist, discharge ALL THE DUTIES of your ministry.

    “Keep your head” includes NOT getting drunk.

    Luke 12:45-46 … suppose the servant says to himself, ‘My master is taking a long time in coming,’ and he then begins to beat the menservants and maidservants and to eat and drink and GET DRUNK.
    The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will CUT HIM TO PIECES AND ASSIGN HIM A PLACE WITH THE UNBELIEVERS.

    “eat and drink and GET DRUNK” in that passage probably means self indulgence and spiritual foolishness while NEGLECTING what God wants doing.

    Toronto “Blessing” type phenomena produce manifestations such as mental euphoria, body vibrations, twitching, slurred speech, gibberish speech and sound effects, animal acts – dogs, chickens, lions, snakes, etc., staggering about, falling over (“slain”), and having uncontrollable/irrational laughter.

    These are manifestations of the god of CHAOS – Lucifer.
    People who participate are unwittingly practicing MOCKERY of the Bible, mockery of God the Father, mockery of Jesus Christ and mockery of the Holy Spirit.

    Participators who come to this realisation should repent and DELIBERATELY AVOID any recurrences. They should also warn others, as it will be disastrous on judgement day for people who PERSISTED in spiritually fornicating with Satan’s minions “familiar spirits”.

    I was previously deceived about Toronto “Blessing” in a church I attended.
    I tolerated it due to experiences I had at a Christian training school about 4 years prior, as well as not comparing it sufficiently against Bible counsel.

    PRIDE could make a person unwilling to face the possibility they have been deceived, and then to remove themselves from the convenience of continuing in fellowship with others who indulge in false ministry.

    It is God himself who gives DIVISIVE COUNSEL:
    Rev 18:4-5 “COME OUT OF HER, MY PEOPLE, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues.”

    Will people heed God’s warning?
    Sadly, MANY WON’T because they are either in love with a false Christ who gives them tickles, or have insufficient “fear of the Lord”:
    Prov 14:26-27 He who FEARS THE LORD has a secure fortress, and for his children it will be a refuge. The fear of the LORD is a fountain of life, turning a man from the snares of death.

    Toronto “Blessing” type phenomena have been called “new wine”.

    It is actually spiritual ADULTERY, and therefore MADDENING WINE:
    Rev 18:3 the nations have drunk the MADDENING WINE of her ADULTERIES.

    At the height of a Toronto “Blessing” era I experienced in the mid 1990’s, the church services were a MADHOUSE OF MANIFESTATIONS.
    They used to have evenings where cushions were put all over the floor for all the FALLING OVER that went on.

    “Slain”…….. churches are falling over!

    The Holy Spirit will be GRIEVED by Christian people fornicating with spiritual sensations from the Devil: Eph 4:30 do not grieve the Holy Spirit.

    Phenomena like Toronto “Blessing” push people towards mental illness, such as BIPOLAR DISORDER, through giving them tremendous euphoric “high’s”, (supposedly a “blessing” from God), then they come crashing down into UNBEARABLE depression when the “high” wears off.

    This causes them to seek more of the “high” and become FAMILIAR SPIRIT DRUG ADDICTS.

    Mental illness and demon influence are sometimes different names for the same thing.

    This is how churches are becoming “Babylon”: Rev 18:2 “She has become a home for demons and a haunt for every evil spirit”

    1 Tim 6:11 But you, man of God, flee from all this, and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, endurance and gentleness.

  31. Kenneth says:

    Well There Is More Todd Bentley SCAMS “Pastors That need too be EXPOSED Like Dick,Joan Dewert ( Had Lots of Affairs behind his Wife’s Back Since 2006!!)”That’s why he Was FIRED From The “Miracle” Channel.

    He Is leading A So Called Christian Event January 27-30 2011 In Calgary!! Called Unite For Domonion But Honestly It’s All About His POWER “Dick’s” and Lots of $$$ Talks With Scamming Your Bank Accounts !!

    LONG Services Like up Up Too Midnight Like He Did When He Was Part Of The “miracle but Honestly $$$$$$$$$$ Channel Begging For $$$$$$$$ and False Healings and It’s tTe SAME PEOPLE That WAS HEALED From Other Healing Meetings With Bill Prankard,Patricia King !! Ex PAOC Pastors Till They Were Booted Out For False/$$$$$$ Teachings!!!

  32. Doug P says:

    The churches must simply show the love of Jesus to others. Peace, righteousness, faithfulness to Christ, a good heart for others. Giving our time to each other in forgiveness. Having a good laugh, living in humility and purity. Knowing we were all once sinners. Sharing with each other not at a leaders command but from the heart we each have. Meeting needs in love and having cheerfulness while doing it. We don’t need the glitz and fake glamour. Jesus spent and desired to spend time with others almost spontaneously. He was always overjoyed and happy to meet with us and teach us all. Through thick and thin, challenges, setbacks, and troubles.which can happen to everyone. be loyal to Christ and not putting all our hope and treasures into a few peoples scams. Test out the spirits have a bit of doubt and think before you act in hype. God is not in no hurry, he is fully in control. Sit back, praise the lord and feel his contentment and personnel love for you. Your dreams and desires are in Gods great hand. In little way each week , be grateful, and content all the time. Go to different churches and see what people are doing, this helps to eliminate being programmed by one leader all the time. Experience the diversity of Jesus Christ and his wide and vast church out there. Baptists, alliance, Pentecostalism, etc. God loves them all, even catholic, and Anglicans. ,There are good people everywhere if you look, why corner yourself in some cult personality or one sided church. Its not about showing your wealth as a sign from God, but his love and peace and joy. Live for you shall I say? Its helps to have balance. I have been blessed and helped by many types of churches. Met many different people. Allot of folk do intend to do good but the hyped personalities of people can often distract from truth. Only one person who is with you everywhere that is Christ, hype up him in the streets and cities and not some money desiring person who lives for his own reasons. That seems over now, as we each go back to just Jesus and his true love story. Sure read up on people and learn what you can but trust in the lord in your own way. A wide variety of churches with different experiences for you helps to have balance. Cult like devotion strictly to one might harm your own real perception of who Christ is. Perception is based on many experiences and trying different things with others. Learning and getting new fellowship too. Have your own plan and vision in your life and follow what you believe to be right. You will be around you more than others and leaders will be. Devote to Jesus more than anyone where ever you find him leading you each day, and that might be new every day. Scatter to the nations of the world, discover and learn and follow your own heart and not some personality. God is everywhere have you know. Everywhere. In your fellowship and outside where you live and work each day. Believe it. Accept it. Hope in it. In the end only Christ will matter and our own lives. At home with our families and in the midst of our dreams and call. Rejoice quietly in that. Let God touch you. receive his blessing. .No offering needed after this. Go on live and dream and believe. “If you give $20,000 you will be blessed”…..just kidding. “For $19.95…….you can be”……ah forget it.

  33. W.W.Sprake says:

    Today We as christian leaders must arise to the challenge of teaching our brothers and sisters in Christ truth from the word of God , and be willing to correct and lead those to repentance for thier mistakes with Love , patience , long suffering and lead by The Holy Spirit of God so that we may have the mind Of Christ ! I Humbly refer us all to James 3:14 – 18 ” But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. 15 This wisdom descendeth not from above , but is earthly, sensual, devilish. 16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work. 17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. 18 And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace. Now having said this let Him without Sin cast the First Stone ! Know this We leaders may do right in Christ my having the Mind Of Christ amd Not The Mind of the Flesh ! Not all Charismatic People are wrong and not all none Charismactic Leaders are right < "Big surprise " As the Generals {leaders} of Our God come together and Lead by Exsample Repent ourselfs for being Politically correct and not Spiritually Corect Humly ourselfs Pray that God will hear us , God Will hear from Heaven and heal our land and restore to us His mighty Power , along with all that heaven can aford .

  34. Ken Tassey says:

    I watched Bentley on GodTV and then went to Lakeland. I was skeptical before I went but my church leaders, Calvary Assembly Orlando all said it was good. Other pastors that I knew also laid hands on Todd and pushed the revival. My wife and I went and I left after an hour. I had a sick feeling in my stomach when there and it just got worse. I have been, unfortunately for me, able to discern false teachers and it hurts me when I feel it. He was soon exposed for what he is, but the harm he did to believers and non believers from all over the world is immeasurable. This is what makes people turn from Christianity and makes others call us fools for believing. I do not even watch preachers on tv anymore except Charles Stanley and John Hagee. Unless it is directly from The Bible, I cannot listen to it. All the hype and shows at the modern church is just that, hype. The pastors are afraid to preach judgement, they only preach feel good nonsense. I have seen real healings and been part of one. Only Jesus can heal, we are just workers doing His will. There is NO man that can heal.

  35. Yvonne says:

    Hey I really appreciate all your input. Would some one please comment on Dr Che Ahn and his ministry Thank-you

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